Post by lazur on Nov 1, 2022 17:59:09 GMT -5
The trade deadline has passed. Talented Juedy is still a Bronco and the Giants are moving forward on what they have in all positions. Toney was traded for draft capital and that really helps.
What do you think it means? Please guys. Let’s keep it clean. We all see things differently. From player to player and how we feel is what makes this fun. Let’s enjoy the debate.
Here is the list. And it is big
Player Pos. 2022 Team 2023 Team Type Snaps Age Current APY
Saquon Barkley RB
Daniel Jones QB
Nick Gates C
Jon Feliciano LG
Sterling Shepard WR
Justin Ellis IDL
Matt Breida RB
Casey Kreiter LS
Jihad Ward EDGE
Nicholas Williams IDL
Tony Jefferson S
Richie James WR
Jamie Gillan P
Tanner Hudson TE
Jaylon Smith LB
Fabian Moreau CB
Austin Calitro LB
Marcus Johnson WR
Darius Slayton WR
Justin Layne CB
Chris Myarick TE
Oshane Ximines EDGE
Quincy Roche EDGE
David Sills WR
Julian Love S
Jack Anderson RG
Devery Hamilton RT
Giants
For me a few names I feel is a should keep. I would definitely extend Barkley. Now he is a RB and he has had his injuries already. Maybe a 3 year deal? Ward is a pleasant surprise and so is Xemines. Those 2 I definitely would keep to be on the rotation. Jaylin Smith isn’t bad either. Monroe at corner has played well.
I’m on the fence with Love. I do believe Belton will be an upgrade next year.
Feliciano should be kept. He is injury prone but he has value. Gillan at punters should be kept along with our long snapper
Slayton I believe will be cheap and he is a player that I would keep on the back end of the roster or practice squad.
Here is my major debate. Jones. This is where we need to keep it clean. His name is like political topic on this board. Please understand this is my opinion and I will own it regardless how it plays out.
I still think in my own little world Jones ish not the long term answer. Why? Because I believe a franchise quarterback should elevate the entire roster especially Receivers and Olineman. If we go back and look at Manning. Eli groomed 3 sets of receivers. From Plax and Toomer to Nicks, Cruz, Manningham to Odell and company. QBs should be an extension of the coaches on the field. Teaching and grooming. I’m not saying Jones has not done a good job but the receivers room is lacking. I do believe the QB has a big part in that equation. Is it lack of talent? I don’t no. Golladay was a big time target for Stafford in Detroit. Not so much with Jones. AND Detroit Oline was bad all those years with zero run game. Similar situation as here. Why is Golladay struggling? Is it effort? Is it the system? Daboll is a bright coach. Golladay hasn’t earned the right to get playing time? Or is Jones and Golladay not quite getting it together? Maybe all the above.
I also believe Schoen and Daboll are not 100% in on Jones. I’m sure Schoen has a long term plan here. Premium draft capital is a big part of that equation. Will one player turn this thing around. Answer is no. The Giants need more then just Juedy. Or maybe the Giants want to hold onto that draft capital if Jones and Schoen are not even close to an agreement on a contract. What if Schoen thinks Jones is worthy of a high priced back up. Let’s say 17 million a year with incentives to get him to 25 million. I’m sure Passing yards, playoffs, passing TDs will be in that equation. What if Jones camp wants 30 plus. Do you think Schoen will give? I don’t. Today kind of shown us that Joe is firm.
So if that does play out that way. The Giants are in the QB market potentially picking in the 20s. Now that 2nd round pick becomes a big part in the draft because QB trumps receivers when it comes to value. What if a QB they are high on falls to let’s say 15. They can bundle there 1st and 2nd round pick to move up to get him.
If Jones does get extended and now they can build around him. The TE from Notre Dam could be there. How about one of those receivers that are projected to go round 1 Or maybe they extend Jones for a few years and still go QB. Hooker sure would look good with a NY on his helmet.
Looking back at the Bills and how they built that team. They had good cover corners there and DBs. Good overall defense and Oline play. They added Allen then they got there receiver and traded for Diggs. Taylor played well for them and took them to the playoffs. It didn’t stop Them from moving up for Allen. What if this plays out similar with Jones.
For me holding on to draft capital is a big sign of what they are thinking. Maybe adding a veteran corner to hit the ground running. Adding a stud blocker to launch this line to the next level? How about a veteran TE maybe to align with Bellinger? All possibilities for free agency?
I’m holding firm on Joe understands that his roster isn’t even close to where he wants it. But giving up draft capital for a good player will help the team but not enough to get this team to the next level. For me that is a blow on Jones. Think about it. You get Juedy to Rodgers or a guy like Mahomes or Allen. Look what it does. But adding a receiver to a QB like Jones probably won’t push the offense to that next level. I’m a firm believer that Jones is not a complete field reader and processing speed is average at best. So how much is a guy like Juedy really golf to help him if he is behind on getting the ball to him on time and with confidence? Will Juedy help Jones read the defense post and pre snap? Probably not. Now I will give Jones supporters this. Juedy will help Jones complete passes because he will separate better then anyone we have now. You still have to see it and throw it. You can’t have Juedy as your 1st read every pass play. Jones will still face to spread the ball around. Let’s say Jones targets a guy like him 7-9 times a game. Is that enough to dictate the offense moving to a new heights? Probably not.
Let’s evaluate Jones over the next half of the season and see if Jones can grow into a better passer. Even though the receivers are not on par with the league. They are still pro players that are talented. Jones needs to throw them open not just wait for someone to get open. I watt yo see some faster processing and better anticipation on Jones part before I open up my wallet if I’m Schoen.
What are your thoughts on this. Is it the chicken or the egg? Do you think it’s a receiver problem or a QB problem? Or is it still the line? For me it’s a little of both. They need better QB play and better play makers outside the numbers. I personally don’t think upgrading the receivers will take this offense to a new level. It will help but it’s not the complete solution
What do you think it means? Please guys. Let’s keep it clean. We all see things differently. From player to player and how we feel is what makes this fun. Let’s enjoy the debate.
Here is the list. And it is big
Player Pos. 2022 Team 2023 Team Type Snaps Age Current APY
Saquon Barkley RB
Daniel Jones QB
Nick Gates C
Jon Feliciano LG
Sterling Shepard WR
Justin Ellis IDL
Matt Breida RB
Casey Kreiter LS
Jihad Ward EDGE
Nicholas Williams IDL
Tony Jefferson S
Richie James WR
Jamie Gillan P
Tanner Hudson TE
Jaylon Smith LB
Fabian Moreau CB
Austin Calitro LB
Marcus Johnson WR
Darius Slayton WR
Justin Layne CB
Chris Myarick TE
Oshane Ximines EDGE
Quincy Roche EDGE
David Sills WR
Julian Love S
Jack Anderson RG
Devery Hamilton RT
Giants
For me a few names I feel is a should keep. I would definitely extend Barkley. Now he is a RB and he has had his injuries already. Maybe a 3 year deal? Ward is a pleasant surprise and so is Xemines. Those 2 I definitely would keep to be on the rotation. Jaylin Smith isn’t bad either. Monroe at corner has played well.
I’m on the fence with Love. I do believe Belton will be an upgrade next year.
Feliciano should be kept. He is injury prone but he has value. Gillan at punters should be kept along with our long snapper
Slayton I believe will be cheap and he is a player that I would keep on the back end of the roster or practice squad.
Here is my major debate. Jones. This is where we need to keep it clean. His name is like political topic on this board. Please understand this is my opinion and I will own it regardless how it plays out.
I still think in my own little world Jones ish not the long term answer. Why? Because I believe a franchise quarterback should elevate the entire roster especially Receivers and Olineman. If we go back and look at Manning. Eli groomed 3 sets of receivers. From Plax and Toomer to Nicks, Cruz, Manningham to Odell and company. QBs should be an extension of the coaches on the field. Teaching and grooming. I’m not saying Jones has not done a good job but the receivers room is lacking. I do believe the QB has a big part in that equation. Is it lack of talent? I don’t no. Golladay was a big time target for Stafford in Detroit. Not so much with Jones. AND Detroit Oline was bad all those years with zero run game. Similar situation as here. Why is Golladay struggling? Is it effort? Is it the system? Daboll is a bright coach. Golladay hasn’t earned the right to get playing time? Or is Jones and Golladay not quite getting it together? Maybe all the above.
I also believe Schoen and Daboll are not 100% in on Jones. I’m sure Schoen has a long term plan here. Premium draft capital is a big part of that equation. Will one player turn this thing around. Answer is no. The Giants need more then just Juedy. Or maybe the Giants want to hold onto that draft capital if Jones and Schoen are not even close to an agreement on a contract. What if Schoen thinks Jones is worthy of a high priced back up. Let’s say 17 million a year with incentives to get him to 25 million. I’m sure Passing yards, playoffs, passing TDs will be in that equation. What if Jones camp wants 30 plus. Do you think Schoen will give? I don’t. Today kind of shown us that Joe is firm.
So if that does play out that way. The Giants are in the QB market potentially picking in the 20s. Now that 2nd round pick becomes a big part in the draft because QB trumps receivers when it comes to value. What if a QB they are high on falls to let’s say 15. They can bundle there 1st and 2nd round pick to move up to get him.
If Jones does get extended and now they can build around him. The TE from Notre Dam could be there. How about one of those receivers that are projected to go round 1 Or maybe they extend Jones for a few years and still go QB. Hooker sure would look good with a NY on his helmet.
Looking back at the Bills and how they built that team. They had good cover corners there and DBs. Good overall defense and Oline play. They added Allen then they got there receiver and traded for Diggs. Taylor played well for them and took them to the playoffs. It didn’t stop Them from moving up for Allen. What if this plays out similar with Jones.
For me holding on to draft capital is a big sign of what they are thinking. Maybe adding a veteran corner to hit the ground running. Adding a stud blocker to launch this line to the next level? How about a veteran TE maybe to align with Bellinger? All possibilities for free agency?
I’m holding firm on Joe understands that his roster isn’t even close to where he wants it. But giving up draft capital for a good player will help the team but not enough to get this team to the next level. For me that is a blow on Jones. Think about it. You get Juedy to Rodgers or a guy like Mahomes or Allen. Look what it does. But adding a receiver to a QB like Jones probably won’t push the offense to that next level. I’m a firm believer that Jones is not a complete field reader and processing speed is average at best. So how much is a guy like Juedy really golf to help him if he is behind on getting the ball to him on time and with confidence? Will Juedy help Jones read the defense post and pre snap? Probably not. Now I will give Jones supporters this. Juedy will help Jones complete passes because he will separate better then anyone we have now. You still have to see it and throw it. You can’t have Juedy as your 1st read every pass play. Jones will still face to spread the ball around. Let’s say Jones targets a guy like him 7-9 times a game. Is that enough to dictate the offense moving to a new heights? Probably not.
Let’s evaluate Jones over the next half of the season and see if Jones can grow into a better passer. Even though the receivers are not on par with the league. They are still pro players that are talented. Jones needs to throw them open not just wait for someone to get open. I watt yo see some faster processing and better anticipation on Jones part before I open up my wallet if I’m Schoen.
What are your thoughts on this. Is it the chicken or the egg? Do you think it’s a receiver problem or a QB problem? Or is it still the line? For me it’s a little of both. They need better QB play and better play makers outside the numbers. I personally don’t think upgrading the receivers will take this offense to a new level. It will help but it’s not the complete solution